Hey, I found this site from another forum, and let me first say I'm most impressed with the skis you all build, especially the ultra-fat reverse sidecut/camber powder monsters. I've read the construction process over several times, and was wondering if anyone's considered any radically different construction techniques. I know this process is pretty much down to a science among hobbyists and niche ski producers, but what other ways can skis be built?
This page was of particular interest to me. The skis are sort of a throwback to the early days of wooden skis, except with shape of modern skis. According to the text, all the skis listed are crafted out of solid wood, no laminate construction at all. They seem to have a regular plastic base and either regular edges or lignostone edges. It's an interesting idea, but would they actually ski? Assuming that a solid core didn't warp or do anything strange during the construction, would it hold up? Could a completley exposed wood surface like that stand any chance of surviving even one outing of real skiing?
Onto my next question, has anyone actually made skis using just a clamp press? I'd really like to try my hand at making skis sometime, and have access to all the necesarry tools, but don't have the space or equipment to build a pneumatic press. I understand that setting up the skis and creating a quality product would be much more different, but is it possible? I figure that a top mold held down with threaded bolts tightened to a uniform pressure would have a decent chance of being able to apply uniform pressure.
A quick design question going along with the press question, would a zero camber ski make working with a clamp press easier? I would want to build some sort of powder ski, and I noticed that several of your fatties are built with no camber. I would think that this would make it much easier to build a clamp press, because aside from the variations in thickness from the core profile the only curve you'd have to worry about would be the tip. Is there some truth to my assumptions or am I completley clueless here?
Sorry for making you read through all this, and I appreciate any insights you may have.
A couple questions regarding construction...
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I think a solid wood skis could be quite nice to ski. This company (www.skis-bois-tardy.com) is making skis only with laminated wood, and I read they work quite nicely (just unstable at very high speed, in piste).
I have in mind to make wood skis also.
In my opinion, the only problem is that a narrow wood ski has to be thicker (up to 20/25mm in the center) than a composite one, to have the same stiffness, so it gets more fragile when it is bent.
But if you make a wide ski, then you can decrease the thickness (maybe down to 18/20mm) and have the same stiffness than a composite one.
A friend of mine made two pairs of skis with a clamp press: it can work. There is somebody else on the forum that is doing the same. If you look around you can found some pictures. Maybe ask him for advice on the press design.
I have in mind to make wood skis also.
In my opinion, the only problem is that a narrow wood ski has to be thicker (up to 20/25mm in the center) than a composite one, to have the same stiffness, so it gets more fragile when it is bent.
But if you make a wide ski, then you can decrease the thickness (maybe down to 18/20mm) and have the same stiffness than a composite one.
A friend of mine made two pairs of skis with a clamp press: it can work. There is somebody else on the forum that is doing the same. If you look around you can found some pictures. Maybe ask him for advice on the press design.
Here’s a new one for you. Think comp-sand. Have a look at this link. This is a very long thread on this site, but worth the read just for the simple ideas/tech you can develop. Look for the stuff by Bert_Burger. He’s the one putting the ideas out here.
http://www.swaylocks.com/forum/gforum.c ... 946#183391
It is surfboard related, but think about the possibility of making the cores using this tech. It would be possible to build the core with the camber built in. It may seem a bit more complex, but if done right has some really possibilities. The only big tools you really need would be the vacuum press and a way to cut out the final ski. Bert starts this out with some very low tech ideas/tools i.e. a vacuum cleaner, plastic sheeting and masking tape. Also substitute wood veneer and ABS/UHMWPE for divynacell(sp?) for our use.
I plan to try this with some skateboards and snowboards first. If I like the result it’s on to skis.
Hafte
http://www.swaylocks.com/forum/gforum.c ... 946#183391
It is surfboard related, but think about the possibility of making the cores using this tech. It would be possible to build the core with the camber built in. It may seem a bit more complex, but if done right has some really possibilities. The only big tools you really need would be the vacuum press and a way to cut out the final ski. Bert starts this out with some very low tech ideas/tools i.e. a vacuum cleaner, plastic sheeting and masking tape. Also substitute wood veneer and ABS/UHMWPE for divynacell(sp?) for our use.
I plan to try this with some skateboards and snowboards first. If I like the result it’s on to skis.
Hafte
check out grafsnowboards.com, they designed a pretty decent clamp press to start out. They created some simple molds, which can probably be used later if you upgrade to a pneumatic press. They clamped their molds together with allthread.
I would like to point out that I designed a clamp press to laminate my cores and its a little tricky beacause the high pressure spots near the threads pull the washers through the wood, and when threre is uneven pressure the wood will crack...
all in all, i think this is a good and cheap way to start, then once you get the technique and the time, upgrade to a vacuum or pneumatic press.
I would like to point out that I designed a clamp press to laminate my cores and its a little tricky beacause the high pressure spots near the threads pull the washers through the wood, and when threre is uneven pressure the wood will crack...
all in all, i think this is a good and cheap way to start, then once you get the technique and the time, upgrade to a vacuum or pneumatic press.
Most of the reason I'd like to try a zero camber ski is ease of construction. Without any camber creating the bottom mold would be a breeze, as it would only be necesarry to cut curves for the tip and tail. It is true that creating a clamp press might be rather difficult for making multiple pairs of skis with different cambers, I think it would be pretty easy for a no camber ski, and could be a good starting point without getting too commited to making skis.
Vacuum presses do look pretty easy to build, and I think a vacuum press would be a logical progression from a simple clamp press.
Vacuum presses do look pretty easy to build, and I think a vacuum press would be a logical progression from a simple clamp press.
I think that if your heart is set on a clamp press, then your going to have to try a clamp press. The number one thing with any of this stuff is to do what you want. That is why we all read these forums, because we want to do our own thing.
How about combining the fire hose concept with the clamp press? Instead of using a super accurate top mold, why not replace the top mold with inflated fire hose, with a solid surface above the hose? Put a pressure gage on the hose and clamp down the surface above the hose until you are reading the pressure that you want. The fire hose may allow for even pressure on the part.
How about combining the fire hose concept with the clamp press? Instead of using a super accurate top mold, why not replace the top mold with inflated fire hose, with a solid surface above the hose? Put a pressure gage on the hose and clamp down the surface above the hose until you are reading the pressure that you want. The fire hose may allow for even pressure on the part.
James
I think what he is getting at is to seal off a fire hose, i inflate it first, to any pressure, and then clamp it down, this way you will have more even pressure than with a simple solid top mold. For the time and effort, I think your best bet is to go with your instinct and do what is easiest for you and best suits your financial situation....I planned on investing $600 into a pneumatic press and am in over $2000 already, so keep it simple at first, and follow the progression