Ski Builders Forum

Saturday I mounted the bindings on the the Birds Eye Maple skis and took them out for a spin on Sunday. As you can see in the pic, the veneer split in the tip. This was the first time I've worked with veneer. Not sure what caused that to happen. I was bummed when I took them out of the press and saw it.

Also they felt real stiff. For kicks I routed out the edges to remove extra core material to soften the flex. I think it may have helped a little bit.

The low profile tip was not planned and wondered how it might effect the handling/performance of the ski. Skis handled fine.

The cores seem to have a nice flex before layup, of coarse after applying the triax F.G., that stiffens them up. So I'll make the next cores 1 mm or 2 thinner and see how that compares.

They skied very nice. My flame skis are the same dimensions but are maple and poplar. I like the ash core better. Seemed to have a more even flex and handled much better. The morning snow was frozen corduroy. Skis held beautifully on it. As the snow softened through out the day they continued to hold a nice line on the loose granular snow.

I'll be sticking with ash wood cores for the time being.

Birds Eye Maple Veneer Top Sheet - www.certainlywood.com
length 172 cm
Dimensions - 116-72-102
Core - Single piece of Ash, no glue up
Triax F.G - www.Skibuilders.com
Epoxy - QCM
Ptex base - www.Skibuilders.com
Metal edges - www.Skibuilders.com

damn those are purdy. Love the wood veneer. Certainly wood has some nice stuff. We are working on a pair with a new tip that should come out a little different than the rest we have built.

Did the ash cores handle better because the ski is heavier and possibly more damp? I am curious because I really want to try and build a maple core ski. Currently we use a mix of ash and poplar.

Also, are there any advantages of not cutting strips and doing the vertical laminated cores? I have seen a couple people on here do this with fine results.

shopvac wrote:
Also, are there any advantages of not cutting strips and doing the vertical laminated cores? I have seen a couple people on here do this with fine results.

I am curious about this also. Theoretically a solid core could have an inconsistent flex pattern, due to the grain growth.

How did the core feel?

Certainly Woods has a great selection of veneers. I bought some quilted maple and sapele veneer. I have the quilted maple skis made but no bindings on them yet. I'll use the sapele veneer on my next pair which will probably be my last ones for the season. They have good prices and lots to choose from.

I think the ash felt better because they are heavier and the grain patterns were similar. I haven't officially weighed them. I'll do that today and let you know. I also layed an extra strip of VDS rubber on the top of the core about 20 cm long starting at the base of the tip and ran it towards the toe mount. I read some where that helps in dampening so I gave it a try. That could be playing a factor too.

Being new to ski building, every ski is an experiment of some kind. I'm trying to keep the ski build simple for now and build on complexity over time (ie plastic side walls, tip spacers, titanal, etc later) I'm not to worried about wieght at this point. I'm looking to make a ski that holds well on eastern powder (frozen/loose granular, hard pack) and flexes evenly. I'm big enough to bend a stiff ski (5'11'' 195lb). So far I'm fairly happy with the results. But it's also subjective. If I gave the skis to my wife or daughters (all around 5'1'' or 5'2'') I'm sure they would not like them, seeing as they are light weights.

As for solid wood or strips/glue up and which is better..... Without doing specific testing, that's a hard call to make. My other hobby is woodworking so by nature I pay attention to grain patterns. I try to match boards with a similar grain pattern. So if 2 boards have a plain sawn grain pattern (wood grain runs parallel the the face) I match them up. If the boards look like they were quarter sawn (grain runs perpendicular to the face of the board) I'll match those boards together. In furniture making quarter sawn is better because there is less movement (expanding/contratcing) in the wood. So I apply those general rules to ski building too. My bet is that a core made using quarter sawn would be stiffer, but w/o testing hard to say by how much.

If I had boards with mixed grain patterns I'd probably set them aside until I ran out of straight grain wood and cut them into strips and glue them back up flipping the strips to alternate grain pattern, just like in furniture making.

Does it make a difference (ie glue up vs solid)?, I say it would. I plan on making more skis later this year and test a single wood core to one made using strips.

But you never know what really works till you strap them on.

Other reason I use solid wood core is I'm lucky enough to have a stash of wide ash and maple. And I couldn't see cutting the boards up and glueing them back together, unless I decided to mix woods or the grain pattern was funky.

On this build I did not shape the core or route a recess for the metal edge prior to layup. I had heard folks had success with this kind of layup so I tried it. I was skeptical about not routing for the edge. But I have to say the bases are flat. Could it be because of the hard ash, would a softer wood core made a difference, would pressing at great than 40psi cause a convexing problem, did I luck out? IDK, but it seems to have worked and simplified the build, so I'll stick with it for now.

It's saves time, I just cut to length and start planing the profile. I'm not too worried about torsional rigidity at this point. Ash is hard and my cores tend to be on the thick side. They hold really. When I look back and see 2 consistent arcing lines in the snow (Railroad tracks) I know I did something right.

It would be difficult to get a single peice of wood wide enough for a snowboard that has a consistent grain pattern. Probably cost a lot too. So for glueing up I would alternate the grain from one strip to the next.

I agree that a solid wood core ski/snowboard could have an inconsistent flex. If I have a board that has any knots (even very tight small ones) or funky grain I'll set it aside. And I think the reason manufactures do glue ups is for consistency. So the ski made on monday has a predictable and consistent flex as the ski made on friday.

Shopvac- I'm interested your tip design. The other night of skiing we were admiring a pair of Fischer RC4 Racing skis with the hole in the tip. A guy commented, "Wow that's a huge bottle opener!".... So I'm thinking of just that, a built-in bottle opener for apre skiing.

doughboyshredder - you could cut a couple in the tip/tail of a snowboard.

On a more serious note I came across http://www.scottybob.com/skiworks/ and read his reasoning for his ski design, makes some sense... that got me thinking (dangerous at times) but what if the tip also was angled back like the tail for the uphill/inside ski? would that improve turning ability? totally screw you up?.... It would make for left and right ski, not to be put on the wrong feet..

Thanks for the questions and comments. Love to talk more about it, bounce ideas around.... always willing to learn more.

But the best part of a wood ski/snowboard are looks you get in the lift line, PRICELESS!

skidesmond wrote:... I haven't officially weighed them. I'll do that today and let you know.

They weigh in at 9lbs 8ozs on the official kitchen scale with the binding plates on. The quilted maples skis (168cm) weigh in at 8lbs 6oz on the same scale, no plates.