Figment Original taking shape!

chrismp · Post by **chrismp** » Wed Oct 26, 2011 12:29 pm

i see, so that's what makes up for a big part of your cost. i just use fiberglass and resin. comes out smooth enough and definitely thin. i think with having only a layer of fiberglass and some resin between the mold and the heat wires i can get up to temp quicker. with both my blankets running at 700w each i can get my press from 5°C to 100°C in about 20 minutes.
for my purposes they're durable enough. i've used them in the press about five times now without any problems.

FigmentOriginal · Post by **FigmentOriginal** » Wed Oct 26, 2011 2:40 pm

Chris, thanks for the spot check on my math. I am going to order some materials for this project tomorrow and document my success. I'll start with one blanket for the first board and go from there!

I just wish I was looking at finished product by now!

FigmentOriginal · Post by **FigmentOriginal** » Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:49 am

Sweet! Just ordered the wire that I spec'd out in my earlier post.

$18 for 200' of 28ga Nichrome wire.
$129 for the gallon of RTV silicone that Chris linked me to.

Hunt down some fiberglass and other materials while I wait for the shipping!

Looks like this project will be well under $200 for TWO blankets!

Next step is to order the PID controllers, relays, and thermocouples...

MontuckyMadman · Post by **MontuckyMadman** » Thu Oct 27, 2011 1:17 pm

when I tested that method I did not like the way the rubber I used wetted out the glass. The biax was hard to wet and the light weight 9oz twill was too thin. I need durability. We get epoxy under the sheet sometimes and we have to take them in and out occasionally. What I have created feels the most like the industrial blankets I have seen.
The rubber I used viscosity was much thicker than epoxy. Perhaps it has more insulation but I prefer that over getting potentially zapped or damaging the blanket.

chrismp · Post by **chrismp** » Thu Oct 27, 2011 1:19 pm

like i posted in the heat blanket thread: no real need for a PID unless you want to leave the press alone during pressing. a powerful dimmer is much more important to not burn up the blankets!!

my set-up looks like this: watt meter plugged into wall socket so i can keep track of the adjustments i make on the dimmers; one dimmer (kemo m028n) for each blanket with two potis (one for fine adjustments); a thermometer with two thermocouples to monitor the temperature of each blanket. that's it.

when i press i just turn on the blankets, crank the potis till each blanket draws 700w and wait about 15-20 min for the temp to reach ~100°C. then i usually turn down the watts a bit just to keep it around 100°C for about 5 min and turn off the heat. when it drops to around 70°C i take the boards out of the press and put them on a flat surface to cool off.

for me this is a process of watching the press and temp for about 40 min which isn't really that much, but saves me some money on PIDs and relais. and i'd be watching the press during the heat cycle anyway since i don't trust my blankets that much (just look what happened to some of the commercial blankets by simply overheating!).

you could also use a regular resistor that cuts down the wattage for each blanket in combination with a PID, but that wouldn't provide the same amount of flexibility.

the most elegant way would be to combine the dimmers and PID to get a fully automated, yet adjustable system. but like i said, i don't mind watching the press for a while (i usually start cleaning the shop during pressing and take a look at the temp every couple minutes).

chrismp · Post by **chrismp** » Thu Oct 27, 2011 1:23 pm

Montucky, my silicone is a bit thicker than my epoxy as well, but if you really work it into the fiber it works.
as far as insulation goes, i can touch my blankets even at 230v and 700w running through them without getting zapped.

btw, how are you controlling your blankets?

MontuckyMadman · Post by **MontuckyMadman** » Thu Oct 27, 2011 4:20 pm

I have a standard pid and ssr setup. I know I can touch mine but I feel like that extra silicon layer help to protect in case something happens. I can feel the watts surg through at 1300-1400. Would hate to get zapped with 11 amps.
That additional silicon really bonds it all together and makes it feel like a more cohesive unit or something. I just didn't feel like the rtv alone with glass worked for me. what ever works. It aint a party till someone gets hurt and the cops show up.

Richuk · Post by **Richuk** » Fri Oct 28, 2011 9:04 am

Could you laminate it? Is there are film that would provide insulation and protect the silicone from the epoxy.

FigmentOriginal · Post by **FigmentOriginal** » Sat Nov 05, 2011 1:49 pm

So its been really hard to make any progress without power...

We got hit really hard here from that freak snowstorm that rolled through CT on Halloween. Was without power for 6 days!

Materials for blanket construction came in, should be working on that over the next few days. I followed Montucky and I told my girlfriend that she might be able to help me with this project and she got really excited about it. That already makes this project worth while, getting her involved/interested into what I have been working my ass off on for the past few months.

chrismp · Post by **chrismp** » Sat Nov 05, 2011 3:31 pm

god, sounds bad...cold weather and no electricity.

drop me a note if you have even the tiniest question on the blanket build. i'm always glad to help and it's hard to cover every small detail in the thread.

FigmentOriginal · Post by **FigmentOriginal** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 6:10 pm

So things have been moving slowly...

Finally got around to gluing together my first core.
Poplar/Maple.

I also got a chance to start on my heat blanket. Spacing changed a little bit. Blanket will be 11" wide instead of 12". This changes the spacing a little bit. From 1" to 7/8".

At this point the wires are in place, just waiting to be connected and buried in another layer of triax and silicone.

This weekend I hope to knock out either a planer crib or a router bridge. Still not sure what the plan is...

I also got a chance to order a bunch of materials from www.Skilab.com. I have some inserts, base, edges, and VDS on the way.

Time to start looking for some veneers for a topsheet.

Ohh....still have to order resin...arghhhh...Any suggestions? I was thinking about going with Entropy...

MontuckyMadman · Post by **MontuckyMadman** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 10:21 pm

Do yu have wires crossing one another? Cause that would be bad as i understand.

FigmentOriginal · Post by **FigmentOriginal** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 6:52 am

No wires are crossing, at least not yet. I am not planning on having overlapping wires touching if thats what you think. I am going to do the same thing that ChrisMP did. Wire either the +/-, then bury it in drywall tape and silicone maybe even a small strip of triax, then run the other wires over that to the other lead.

twizzstyle · Post by **twizzstyle** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:17 am

As for resin, Entropy or Forrest (formerly QCM) are two popular choices. I used Entropy on my last pair and the stuff is awesome, just more expensive than the QCM stuff I'm used to.

FigmentOriginal · Post by **FigmentOriginal** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 12:16 pm

Thanks twizz. How much do you think I should order to start out?

Maybe enough for 5 narrow snowboards....

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Figment Original taking shape!