Bent Green Things 13/14

vinman · Post by **vinman** » Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:25 am

This is also something I've thought about. Getting vectorply is tough without paying big $$ for it. I'm also thinking about switching fabrics butu have the same reservations about changing fiber weights in different axes.

I can get another product for about 1/4 the cost of what I can get vectorply from....

skimann20 · Post by **skimann20** » Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:48 am

I hear you on the cost. The cheapest I've fond it was for $14 a yard (50" roll) That's not to bad compared to the $8 for 24oz at fiberglass supply. only $6 more a pair of skis. Which makes it doable.

Falls: I like your logic and it's great info to add to the discussion. I have no idea what fiberglass supply has in the +/-45 deg so i can't compare that to Vectroply. This piece of info would help me greatly in my decision. The only thing i would disagree with is: the tighter bundles the stronger the glass. I would compare it cable. the more strands the stronger it is but then again i'm no engineer.

I'm eventually going to put this data into a statistical tool that should be able to pull the multiple variable out of the ski but I need to get more data points. I need more money...

bhenry · Post by **bhenry** » Sun Feb 23, 2014 8:33 am

I was researching this yesterday while preparing to order more materials, (should have been skiing with all the snow we're getting), and
was curious why Fiberglass supply is so much less$ than other suppliers.

Could you make a sample core, say 5" wide and 24" long and 3mm thick using your old triax, and make a few more reducing the thickness with each one and lay up with Vectorply. find the one that is close to the original. Not very scientific, but might avoid laying up an un ski able pair.

skidesmond · Post by **skidesmond** » Sun Feb 23, 2014 9:13 am

Nice comparison photos of the FG. Sounds like it's time for some sample layups and testing to gather data. While your skis are curing do some sample layups of each FG.

I'd be careful about mixing the 2 FG. At least make sure each ski has the same layout order of the FG.

Vectorply is nice stuff. However, I bought 23oz. Vectoply triaxial FG from JamesTown Dist. in RI. It looks more like the pic on the right.
http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/us ... -+Triaxial#

So maybe this Vectorply is second rate they are selling. It still cuts ok, very little fraying. When Ilayed out the FG I pushed the fabic together to reduce the spaces between the fibers. For the price it's pretty good, 50in wide, 2 yards can make 2 sets of skis for under $30.

MontuckyMadman · Post by **MontuckyMadman** » Sun Feb 23, 2014 12:25 pm

All the fg supply stiched glass is split equally in the axes. 24oz is 8oz in each direction.

vinman · Post by **vinman** » Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:10 pm

The vector ply 22 oz is 12.8 in the 0 direction and 5.38 in the +/- 45.

So you would have to add a few carbon tow to equal out that difference in longitudinal flex difference.

I've found one more manufacturer on the east coast and I'm trying to get prices from them their glass is 8.96 in the 0 axis and 6.5 in the +/-45. Still need to add some tow in the 0 axis. The big thing for me on these guys is that they are within a reasonable driving distance, so either the shipping will be less or maybe they might let me pick up.

skimann20 · Post by **skimann20** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 8:34 am

Thank you all for the useful information. So it looks like I would gain more stiffness in the x and lose it in the Y. Tow! ahhh crap, another variable. ;-)

Skidesmond: Not what I wanted to hear. That was the distributor I was look at. Maybe since mine was direct from Vectorply they sent "good" stuff. this is the photo they have on their website, some seperation:

Vinman: care to share your new company? I too am on the east coast.

All: Shall I entertain doing a group buy on Vectorply again. I talked to them last year and they would be willing to split it up into rolls but I have to buy the entire roll. let me know on that one.

found this nice one from Volkl. looks like they have good separation too:
http://www.voelkl-snowboards.com/produc ... ayers.html

skidesmond · Post by **skidesmond** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 9:51 am

I would do sample layups, say 3x24, and then test them for flex and torsional stiffness. You may find difference to be acceptable. As you know there are so many variables. I concentrate on the variables I can control the most which are resin ratios (weighing the mix using a digital scale), consistent core processing, adequate and even pressure. Heck, even cnc cores may weigh differently just because of the difference in wood density with a wood specie.

I wouldn't overly worry about it. Although when I buy FG I don't use FG in a pair of skis from a previous purchase of FG.

vinman · Post by **vinman** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 1:56 pm

Fiberglass Industries in Amsterdam, NY. So far their NE rep has not responded to at least 2 emails from me in the sat month or so.... I may have to call them.

skimann20 · Post by **skimann20** » Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:34 pm

vinman wrote:Fiberglass Industries in Amsterdam, NY. So far their NE rep has not responded to at least 2 emails from me in the sat month or so.... I may have to call them.

The economy must be doing well... I have the same issue with most sales reps. ski building and work related. good luck man and thanks for sharing, it looks like it has weight in the right directions. Maybe I'll start hounding him too. ;-)

Just ordered up some more CF today. Accidentally called the wrong company but got it figured out before i placed my order.

Emailed Vectorply i should get a response in a while...

FYI: soller composites has a great sale on 6.0oz. ,IM7 822Ksi, 40 Msi. I stuck with my 9oz but the stuff looks good and at a great price.

MadRussian · Post by **MadRussian** » Tue Feb 25, 2014 5:09 pm

sometimes ago I use 2x FG from Composite One and it was much different compared to 3x from Fiberglas supply. Much better stitched also fibers layout much tighter...don't know manufacture.... probably Vectorply.
At the time performance was not important because it was not for skis.
Good question is the Vectorply better performance wise compared to Fiberglas supply product.
If infarct Vectorply is better and enough people interested in group buy
I can probably get it in full roll only, here locally, much cheaper compare to Jamestown distributors price. IIRC 24oz full roll is 50 inches wide and 100 yards long undated $800

vinman · Post by **vinman** » Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:55 pm

FYI.....FGI in Amsterdam NY, says they don't sell in small quantities. Just as well their longitudinal fiber weight is lacking a little compared to Vector Ply, their loss, the niche ski market is up and coming and we all need materials.

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Bent Green Things 13/14